[01/09/2010 at 07:13]
Ulrich: Yo! Happy spring dude!
Brett: One sec, kettle on, go for it…
Not authentic if we don’t have some caffeine in here somewhere.
Ulrich: Thanks for making sure we do…
There is always a lot of debate about whether a person who is passionate for God should go into fill time ministry or whether they should still work in the secular industry. Some say working in the secular industry makes you a “part-time Christian…”
Brett: True [laughed the full-time ministryalbanian boy].
The problem lies in the definition of full-time ministry.
Ulrich: I agree – I believe that full-time ministry is devoting your life completely to God. That can be done in many ways…
Brett: Well I think this can probably be filled under the spiritual vs secular divide – think we’ve had that discussion before – how some activities such as attending prayer meetings or a youth group or reading your bible or singing a worship song we call “spiritual”, whereas other activities like going to the beach with friends, watching a movie, playing a game of hockey or kissing your girlfriend/boyfriend we call “secular”.
Ulrich: Like the vibe, “How you are where you are.”
Brett: Whereas we can clearly see from the Bible [e.g. Colossians 3.17 and 23] that God wants to be involved in every part of our lives.
Ulrich: My friend uses a term that I like – “everything is spiritual.”
Brett: So yes, by default everything is spiritual, or should be… If you are a Christian, you are called to fulltime ministry. But we are not ALL called to be paid for it.
That’s a very basic way of summing it up, but you know what I mean – some people will be in official ministry-type positions, such as a pastor, youth worker or in some churches even worship director or whatever… Whereas a teacher is called to be a God-following-surrounded teacher and a plumber the same – make the most of every opportunity to share, display and echo God’s love and kingdom.
A pastor is way more spiritual than a teacher right? I knew a pastor who was quite manipulative and had an affair with one of the married women in the church and on the other side I know a teacher who teaches kids so much about God, both by who she is and what she says (and she teaches a lot of Muslim kids and they’re fine with it because she just radiates it and it is so real) and so in that case suddenly the teacher looks a lot more “spiritual” than the pastor. As you said before – “how you are where you are” – whether you are a pastor or a teacher (or a hip-hop instructor) be a Holy Spirit filled Jesus-loving one, radiate His love and kingdom.
Ulrich: The challenges when working in a Christian environment differ from secular situations, but both have challenges…
Brett Anderson: Yeah and having worked in so-called “Christian environments” most of my life I think sometimes the challenges there are greater – maybe we can do a vibe on the evils of church politics one day…
The point is that we need teachers who are Jesus-loving, we need lawyers who are Jesus-loving… not so sure about drug dealers – I would imagine there are definitely some jobs (not sure that’s a job though) that a Christ-follower is not able to do…
Ulrich: It’s about finding your God-given passions and using them for Him by surrendering to Him and allowing him to place you in, or guide you into WHATEVER place and circumstance.
Brett Anderson: True.
Ulrich: I’m studying law now; it is where I believe (how do I know: peace) I am meant to be. However, that does not confine me to law. God wants you, not a piece of paper. Explanation: although I am studying towards having a legal qualification, I am still able to be used in any type of instance or situation, whether in the legal field or not! Example – Moses: public speaker according to the world – no; in and with God – yes.
Brett Anderson: It is important not to lift one of the jobs above another, so that stuff we see as full-time ministry is somehow seen as more important to God, or more holy…
In law you can be a money-grabbing get-to-the-top-of-the-pile lawyer or you can choose to get involved (like my buddy Bren) in cases and litigation linked to trafficking and social justice; using your job for kingdom stuff.
Ulrich: Like I said, I’m studying law, but what if I went into divorce law or had to help someone with divorce papers? I don’t know if I could do that. Some say you can minister to them, which I would by trying to help them, but if they still want a divorce, if that is my job, I would have to do it…
Brett Anderson: I’m not sure there is a have to – same as with a doctor who ‘has to’ perform an abortion – I think there are certain things you will be faced with in certain jobs where walking away from the job (as crazy mad as that sounds) might be the thing to do if there is no way around the compromise you are called to take.
And that is a key question, O-man, if you get faced with such a choice… do you have the faith in God that He will provide for you and make a way?
Ulrich: What about a divorce lawyer or drug dealer who does that type of work to reach Christians…
Brett Anderson: I think I would seriously have to question those and I’m not saying that I have the definitive list on what jobs are okay and what ones are not but I think if you get into that situation and ask God for guidance He will give it and sometimes that will mean walking away from something…
Ulrich: You don’t have a definite list, but the bible offers guidance and if in your Quiet Times (really important) you notice a certain path leading you away from God then you should move away from that job/situation.
Brett Anderson: In summing up I would say that:
[A] We need to stop making a distinction between fulltime ministry and other jobs.
[B] God loves you and wants to be a part of whatever vocation – fancy word for job – you choose to be in. Ask for His guidance when choosing a career but once you have one make sure to include, involve and invite Him to be a part of, and at the centre of, it.
[C] Live the kingdom – so if you are a pastor be a Holy Spirit filled pastor and use every opportunity to serve God by loving Him and loving people, and if you are a supermarket till person then be a Holy Spirit filled supermarket tiller person (start by smiling at people and being friendly) and use every opportunity etc.
[D] There may be a time in your job when you face a situation that may even cause you to walk away from your job so that you can keep your integrity, character and walk with God intact – God will never expect you to compromise on your faith in Him for the sake of keeping a job!
Have a rad day dude, been good vibing, look out for October and November issues of Vision magazine where ‘What’s the Vibe?’ will be featured.
Ulrich: Nice conclusion.
Thanks Brett, been great.
[07:49]
What's the Vibe? 